While SANZAR ponders whether any steps should be taken against Stormers captain Schalk Burger and coach Allister Coetzee, statistics have been released that reveal just how silly they were for criticising match referee Craig Joubert.
From SA Referees website
Johan Botes, a South African-based SANZAR Director, confirmed that a decision whether to charge Burger and Coetzee for their ungracious post-match outbursts – following their 17-25 Super 14 Final loss to the Bulls at the weekend – will be taken on Tuesday.
The Stormers captain was scathing with his comments of the match official.
“It was pretty disappointing, I thought the Bulls and us were playing two different sets of breakdown rules,” Burger said, adding: “We couldn’t get momentum going, which was really disappointing.”
Burger later repeated his attack on the referee’s rulings, claiming that the penalties against his team had an influence on the outcome of the game.
“Yes, I was unhappy about it to be honest, otherwise I would have kept my mouth and not complained like I did on the field,” Burger said when quizzed about it in the post-match media conference.
The remarks of the Stormers coach, Coetzee, will now also come under scrutiny, after he also expressed his disappointment in Joubert’s officiating.
“It was an area where the game was won and lost,” Coetzee told a post-match media briefing.
However, stats revealed on Monday show that the referee, Joubert, was more that just equal and fair in his handling of the match.
André Watson, the South African Rugby Union refereeing boss, said it was not a case of referees not being able to handle criticism.
“Of course we have to take it on the chin,” Watson said of occasions when match officials get it wrong.
“However, this is not criticism,” Watson told rugby365.com.
“If what is being quoted in the media is true – that there are two sets of rules and one team was coached – then the insinuation is that the referee was bias or was cheating.
“I simply can’t accept that. I can’t accept that we say things like that.”
The referees boss said he decided to go have a look at the match closely and – using their Fairplay programme – spent four hours looking at the tackle/ruck situations in the Final.
“The Stormers carried the ball 85 times,” Watson told rugby365.com, adding: “The Bulls took it into a tackle situation – which became a ruck or just stayed a tackle – 82 times.
“Out of that the Stormers were awarded seven penalties and six penalties were awarded to the Bulls.
“In those same phases the referee spoke 25 times to the Stormers and spoke to Bulls players on 28 occasions – never once did he repeat a warning.
“I find it strange that that is labelled as ‘coaching’.
“In fact these are staggering stats that show how incredibly fair and accurate he [referee Craig Joubert] was. I just felt the facts should be on the table.”
Watson also confirmed that a formal review of Joubert’s performance would be conducted by SANZAR bosses on Tuesday, but said he, Watson, has already looked an analysed Joubert’s performance.
He admitted there were a few errors.
“In my opinion he had a phenomenal first half,” Watson said, adding: “Obviously there are mistakes.
“One of those could place a question mark over Bryan Habana’s intercept try. Let me make it clear, Bryan did nothing wrong, but what happened before – No.22 [replacement Tim Whitehead] came in at the side and deliberately slowed down the ball, giving the Bulls a bad ball. That’s a blatant transgression that was overlooked.
“There was another occasion when [Bulls flank Deon] Stegmann stole a ball, but the slow-motion analyses showed he was illegal.
“After having worked through all those incidents I found three errors, out of 167 tackle/ruck situations.
“I think that is great and we can be happy with his performance.
“I know, it doesn’t matter how I put this, people will say: ‘Look, Watson is covering for his referee again’. I am well aware that I will be criticised, but it is important that we put the facts out there and not just opinions.”
By Jan de Koning
sareferees.co.za
I am so sick and tired of this moaning, my God!!!!!!!!! Thats why I am glad that the Bulls won or we would have never heard the end of this. They got outclassed by a better team who held their composure better. Stop crying like babies Stormers, you lost, its over…You sound like spoilt brats that didnt get their way. Myself as a Shark have watched my side lose 3 Super finals,it sucks but life goes on 🙂
What a bunch of claptrap…
Asking a referee to judge a referee…
Only 3 mistakes in the whole game? That is the greatest heap of rubbish I have ever heard. Even a good referee makes more than three mistakes. Ag why even comment? The result is in, the Bulls won, irrespective of whether I am happy or not.
Accountability in this game is beginning to become ridiculous, Freedom of Speech is a basic human right, but not in rugby circles.
This is for all the Stormers supporters that moan too much. BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Schalck Burger and Alistair Coetzee owe Graig Joubert an apology.
True to WP/Stormers they are not good enough to do so.
I have heard 80 year old woman with a wet set of panties moan less than this 🙂
Winston have to agree with you. Far too much moaning about the ref from some Stormer supporters not all.
Don’t think there was much of a contest really, Stormers were outplayed and out thought by Bulls. Stormers never once looked like they would win the game to me. Bulls were all over them. Bulls kicking game was outstanding with FdP and Morne with their pin point kicks. Put plenty pressure on the Stormers. The Bulls tackling was ferocious. For me this was a one sided final. Bulls never ever looked like they would lose. Ricky never grounded that ball that was given a try and Morne gifted Habs a try. It if was not for that Bulls would have won 25 – 3
Now I have seen Sharks in 3 finals and they lost them. The last one in 2007 we should have won that one. Lead the whole way to lose it in the end. That is heart breaking. Life goes on and you wake up the next day and the sun still shines. There is always next year. 😀
OK, all of you self-righteous sharks jumping aboard the bandwagon about the Stormers moaning about the ref…I have two words for you… PAUL MARKS.
How goes the saying? Removing something from one’s own eye is it?
Secondly…
THE TRY WAS AWARDED TO PIETER LOUW NOT JANUARY FOR FARKS SAKES!
8 – Saint, Have to look at it again. Cause it never looked like it was grounded over the line.
CALM DOWN YOU WILL GIVE YOURSELF A HERNIA…..HEHEHEHEHE. You sounding like a sore loser 😯 😀
7 – Saint, HUGE difference we should have won that game. STORMERS WERE OUTPLAYED TOTALLY by Bulls buddy. They were losing by 16/zip at one stage and could have lost by 25/3 had that intercept not happened by Habs (Morne gifted Habs that try) still that was no try it by January or Flo it was not grounded over the line.
With Paul Marks the complaints were less.
@ Puma:
Who says you should have won? That is merely your opinion, I see no difference whatsoever. All I see is a marked attack on the Stormers, and maybe some sour grapes, because WE actually reached the semi’s.
@Everyone Else
IMO the Stormers would have lost this match in any case, we weren’t on our game, but to deny the influence of Joubert is ludicrous…
Taking the word of a Referee regarding the actions of a referee…Oh wow, you guys truly amaze me…
I remember Bryce Lawrence defending both Marks AND Walsh at those times, saying they did quite well under curcumstances. The Bulls had an implosion against Steve Walsh earlier this year, saying the guy knows nothing about rugby, they even moaned and groaned about Joubert, now suddenly, no-one ever moans about the referee?
Please guys grow up, yes, maybe Burger and Coetzee was out of line, and should have taken the silent route, even though some of the comments are valid.
But this holier than thou attitude that most of the bloggers on this site has suddenly taken up is sickening. Suddenly we are a kak team, whinging all the time, while I haven’t even seen one piece of whinging this whole season from the Stormers, I’d like anyone to prove me wrong.
The Bulls almost became pregnant when Bakkies and Van den Heever was cited. Even though Bakkies is a thug at the best of times.
I knew that mostly all teams in SA is anti-Stormers but this is getting to be ridiculous.
saint @ 12
well said!!
@ The Saint:
Grow a pair buddy…
” I knew that mostly all teams in SA is anti-Stormers ” I mean really, I think we all know the majority supporters in SA wich support another team is in actual fact
This statistic might change though if the Stormers keep on whining about this. 😉
Secondly… ” maybe Burger and Coetzee was out of line ” Coetzee, not so much but Burger…
Sulk Burger was way out of line !!!
He should at least get the same penalty that Giteau got.
Having said that, most people seem to admit that the Stormers were never realy in the game, yet still some of them like to add the but if…
Oh and lastly… The Stormers did’nt win because they did’nt pitch for the game… 🙂
should read is in actual fact anti-Bull…You just have to look at the CC-finals…
Are’nt you guys excited that the BULLS will keep the S14 trophy FOREVER !!! 😆
Bulls , most successful team in S14 ever.
Winning the trophy 60 % of the time !!!
:lol :lol 😆
The Blue Bulls Company (Pty) Ltd would like to use this opportunity to sincerely thank all shareholders, management, players, coaches, personnel, media, supporters and the people of Soweto for their fantastic contribution to make the Vodacom Super 14 final such a memorable event.
It is much appreciated.
Congratulations also to Frans Ludeke and Victor Matfield and their team for the brilliant achievement and the humble way they are carrying their banner as champions.
The CEO of the BBC, Barend van Graan, would particularly like to thank his staff for their hard work this last couples of weeks at the Loftus Versfeld, Orlando Stadium, Hatfield and SuperSport Park venues.
There will be no victory parade through the streets of Pretoria or anywhere else due to the large number of Bulls players that are already involved in the Springbok team’s preparations. It might be held at a later date.
Hoe lyk hierdie een:
Bitterbek Burger klap soos Quixote.
Blouste, I for one am excited that the Bulls have won three S14 titles. I’m also exited that the Stormers made it to the final and that the Sharks showed their true potential towards the end of the S14. It says a lot about the strength of our rugby.
Unfortunately, what detracts from the Bulls’ historic achievement is the apparent inability of some of their fans, even here on RT, to handle this achievement with the grace and dignity that the Bulls players themselves display.
In my opinion, the Stormers stuffed up by complaining (only once though, after the game and not endlessly as is being claimed here) about Joubert. They can take a leaf out of the Bulls’ book on post match interviews.
@ The Saint:12 – Saint, You going on and on wont make a difference to the end result. No matter which ref was there Bulls were just too good for Stormers on Saturday. It was a one sided final mate.
Yes we all have a moan about the refs. Sharks got a really bad call by Walsh in 2007 that COST us the game. We should have won that also against the Tahs. Should have been a penalty try and also that try at half time was no try, also not grounded over the line. You going on like you lost by one point and it cost your team the game. Your team was well out of it. If there was one or two points in it I could understand the frustration by the Stormer supporters. Stormers lost by a huge amount. Remember Morne gifted Habs a try take 7 points out of that leaves your team with 10 points to 25 of the Bulls. Take another 7 points away from a try that I think was not a try. Who ever it was never grounded the ball over the line. Stormers should have had 3 points!!!!!!!!!! There is the difference. Stormers were not in this game at all. When Sharks lost it was by one or two points. If a ref costs you a game that close yes, then moan.
Remember Sharks beat the Stormers and after what did Burger say? Never gave Sharks any credit at all just said Stormers were flat on the day that is why they lost. Not cause Sharks outplayed your team. Think Burger once again let himself down by moaning about the ref. He has had a outstanding season rugby wise and as captain but those two times after his team got beat he sounded a bit sour while being interviewed.
Now let it go. I watched Sharks lose 3 finals. It happens. Just look on the bright side you have a really good team and they will be back next year.
Now move on. We all one again this Saturday…. 😀 Bokke are back. Well our 2nd team but still we will all be one supporting them.
@ fender:
Aag ou fender, ek dink ook julle span het baie goed gedoen man, weereens geluk.
Wens ek kon julle Stormpies nog so bietjie moeilikheid gee, maar lyk my die meeste kry dit self goed reg 😉
Kom al julle Stormers en vertel net eers gou vir ons hoe gaan volgende jaar JULLE jaar wees, sien CJ & Jean de Villiers is ook oppad na julle…
As julle dit klaar gedoen het kan ons oorgaan na die Wallis toets !!! 😉
😆 😆 😆
blouste @ 14
agree … we never pitched for that game. we were never in it and never looked likely to win it at any stage anyway!!
now back to the “moaning” …. are we allowed to DISCUSS claims made by schalk and coetzee or are we not?
if the majority of enlightened bloggers feel that we shouldnt discuss it as it constitutes moaning, i’ll be more than willing to discuss the upcoming welsh test!!
your humble rugby servant
asbakkie
@ Ashley:
😆
Discuss, uhm, moan away !!! 😆
See post 22 😉
@ fender:20 – Morning Fender, Nice post there by you. Agree.
Aan alle Stormers supporters op RT.
Ek kan eerlik se dat ek nerens gelees het dat een van julle ouens regtig “out of line ” was nie…
Julle klomp moegoes was eintlik ok na julle NEDERlaag !!!
😆
Howzit PUMA
Glad to be back ? 🙁
blouste @ 24
lol, saw it!!
ok here goes
discuss discuss discuss discuss discuss discuss
or was
moan moan moan moan moan?
ok, i’m finished ….. wheres the thread for the upcoming test?
goooooooooooooooooooooooo bokke!!
Blouste wrote:
Dit is net van toepassing op julle supporters hier.
Op ander sites gaan van die manne woes te kere 😯
@ Blouste:27 – Had a great holiday. Nice and relaxed. 😀 So not happy to be back. 🙁
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