Heyneke Meyer
If international coaches were judged on passion for their country rather than results, Heyneke Meyer would rank alongside anyone in rugby union’s history. Never has a badge been gripped so tightly at anthem time. The 48-year-old lived each game as if his life depended on it. When the Springboks won it was all worthwhile; when they lost it was painful to behold.
Sadly, it was those gut-twisting defeats that Meyer could ultimately not escape. Not unlike Stuart Lancaster with England, he will be remembered as an extraordinarily decent man who could not quite generate sufficient on-field success. To be the coach of a Springbok team beaten by Japan at a World Cup is hardly a recipe for securing a shiny new four-year contract.
And so Meyer has stepped off the stressful, unpredictable Bok wagon before he was pushed. On his better days – and South Africa won 67% of their games under his stewardship – the Boks were well-motivated, grimly physical, defensively impressive and tricky to beat. On the debit side he persisted with senior players who were visibly past their best and South Africa’s attacking game was seldom as dangerous as their leading rivals.
That aspect of the game is continually evolving and maybe Meyer knew in his heart of hearts that, even if reappointed, he could not simply revert to the uncomplicated, forward-dominated method that worked so well during his provincial glory days with the Blue Bulls in Pretoria. South Africa also lost to Argentina for the first time before the World Cup and, while gritty in their performances against Wales and New Zealand, rarely looked like repeating their triumph of 2007.
“Since returning from England I have realised that as much as I believe I still have a lot to offer, the time has come for change,” Meyer said. “My integrity has always been very important and I feel I can leave with my head held high. I’ve always maintained that my only motivation was to serve my country and to do what was best for the Springboks.”
He will also have been aware of the rising external pressure from those who feel transformation within South African rugby requires fresh impetus. Rather than following England’s example and appointing an overseas coach, Meyer’s likely successor is Allister Coetzee, who hails from the Eastern Cape and would appease the vocal lobby who insist the Springboks remain too white in their thinking.
Coetzee, 52, was an assistant coach alongside Eddie Jones when South Africa won the World Cup in 2007 under Jake White and has coached the Stormers in Cape Town for the past six years. He has just started a new job in Japan with Kobe Kobelco Steelers but, as Jones has just shown, that does not preclude him from a U-turn should a national union come calling.
The experienced Coetzee is also a less divisive figure than South Africa’s first black coach, Peter de Villiers, and, if appointed, would be able to select from an increasingly deep pool of youthful promise in the shape of players such as Handre Pollard and Jesse Kriel. The South African Rugby Union, however, is also committed to non-whites making up half of all domestic and national squads by 2019. During the World Cup they were required to include seven non-white players, including two black Africans, in their 23-man match squads.
Juggling such imperatives with the need to keep winning Test matches makes the South Africa coaching job as demanding as any in the world. Many of the provincial unions, who were due to vote next week on whether or not to retain Meyer, were already agitating for his removal, with the Western Province president, Thelo Wakefield, suggesting “drastic changes are needed if we want to move South African rugby forward”.
Coetzee, accordingly, could be installed swiftly as the Boks prepare to enter an intriguing new phase. “We have reached a natural watershed in many ways with a significant number of senior players either retiring or moving overseas as well as the fact our strategic transformation plan is now in full swing,” said Saru’s president Oregan Hoskins.
South Africa’s next fixture is not until next June but Meyer’s successor will have his hands full from the outset.
theguardian
@ robzim:
@ MacroPolo:
Gees or guts and glory in the Bok sense is when we fight like demons to stay in the game against the All Blacks, but ultimately lose in the last quarter.
We have fighting spirit, but lack the class of the opposition.
I don’t believe the Boks show more gees towards the jersey than the All Blacks.
They know if they play overseas they forfeit the Black jersey, so it doesn’t matter the offer, their top players stick it out in NZ for the honor of playing for the All Blacks.
IMO, the Boks manage to gee themselves up to another level only when facing the All Blacks and the Poms. It’s like waving a red flag to a bull when we face those two and we play above ourselves. Not sure why we don’t do it against all opposition.
Angostura wrote:
True
Not sure why some still clamor for him to have stayed on, he had his 4 years, didn’t make it, and it’s time for him to move on, like all those before him (even ones that did better than him)
@ nortie:
Well make no mistake, im not saying that more gees makes you the better team on the field, the other factors are also important, such as tactics or even moments of brilliance, BUT gees is big, Japan looked like a team with a lot of “gees” and they have looked so for every world cup I watched, that does not even nearly mean they will win.
The bulls at the end of last years super rugby had fokol gees, they all looked die donner in for each other, and it showed especially in their results.
Gees is what keeps the guys together if things look like unraveling, and is crucial for any team sport… given you have to skills, strategy or talent to get you close.
Weer uit die perd se bek:
http://www.supersport.com/rugby/general-rugby/video/629074
Hoskins sê dat die belangrikste taak van die nuwe bokafrigter is transformasie, nie of hy ‘n goeie afrigter is nie.
Hoekom stel hul dan nie sommer vir Malema aan nie ?
Ja dit is so, HM het sy beurt gehad en dit is verby.
Maar uit ‘n rugby perspektief, gaan dit help om iemand aan te stel wie se wedstrydplan nog swakker en meer konserwatief was as HM s’n ? Hopelik het AC, as hy aangestel gaan word, ‘n nuwe wedstrydplan, dan sal ons almal bly wees.
Maar soos ek van die begin gesê het, moenie dink dit is oor rugby redes wat die nuwe bokafrigter aangestel gaan word nie, daar het Hoskins dit bevestig, dit is politiek wat die hoofrede is.
Sterkte vir AC, hopelik kry hy ‘n goeie afrigtingspan.
Kan net nie dink waarom ‘n ou soos Ackers liewers vir die ANC sal wil werk as hulpafrigter, as hy as hoofafrigter vir die Leeus kan werk nie ?
HM kon nog bietjie daarmee wegkom die afgelope 4 jaar, maar die nuwe afrigter sal sekerlik ‘n spesifieke getal kwotas moet handhaaf anders verloor Hoskins sy vakansiehuis in die Bahamas.
@ Ben-die-Bul:
The fact of the matter is that transformation is a fact and it is not something that is going to go away so the appointment cannot be for “rugby- reasons” only. If 2 coaches are more or less of equal quality then it makes sense to appoint the one with the better transformation record. It is however not fair to say AC was only appointed for transformation reasons.
I would say the changes that the Bok team will have a winning record of approximately 65% over the next 4 years is very good irrespective of whether Meyer, Coetzee, Jake White, Rassie Erasmus etc is the coach as there is not really that much difference between the different coaches in terms of technical coaching- or managing ability.
65 @ robzim:
Or quality of players
@ Ben-die-Bul:
“Kan net nie dink waarom ‘n ou soos Ackers liewers vir die ANC sal wil werk as hulpafrigter, as hy as hoofafrigter vir die Leeus kan werk nie ?”
http://www.sarugbymag.co.za/blog/details/meyer-anc-on-my-side
65: ja, mens moet die beste van die slegte saak probeer maak, maar dit beteken nie ons moet daarvan hou nie ?
Die Bulle gaan bv volgende seisoen gedwing word om Orie te speel op slot in die beginspan. Hy is nie te sleg nie, maar op sy beste tans ‘n goeie VC en CB speler. Hy gaan beter spelers op die bank of uit die span hou: Snyman, Jenkins, Janse van Rensburg.
So was Kolisi nie beter as Coetzee of Kriel nie, en Paige nie beter as Hougaard nie.
67: hehe, ou HM is duidelik nie ‘n politikus nie, hy ken nie die Brutus-Ceasar politiek en hoe dit werk nie. Soos die ou gesegde sê, wanneer weet jy ‘n politikus lieg …. wanneer hy sy mond oopmaak.
Hopelik kan AC hulle beter speel ?
68 @ Ben-die-Bul:
Ben, ek twyfel of die nuwe coach, of dit AC, Akkers of wie ookal sal wees, se span slegter sal doen.
Of ons weer, in my leeftyd, n WB sal wen, dit twyfel ek.
Om eerlik te wees, ek het al voor die WB, toe ons tuis teen die Argentyne verloor, al hoop opgegee.
Wat my aanbetref kan hulle nou maar maak en breek met die Bokke (of noem hulle maar Proteas for that matter) net soos hulle wil.
Ons rugby is in sy moer in, kyk net die gemors by die Kings.
Ek sal die SR volg en kyk hoe die nuwe vormaat werk en of dit die moeite werd is of nie, maar toets rugby van die Bokke worry ek nie meer oor nie
robzim wrote:
I think 65% should be seen as the new benchmark for the Boks, we’re also very fortunate to play teams like Italy and Scotland to inflate our wins.
If our Super Teams can’t even be competitive, it’s unreasonalble to expect the Boks to be
Add the ANC/SARU’s new transformation targets from next year onwards, which has sweet fanny f***all to do with rugby like Hansen rightly said, and will weaken our teams even more across the board
In a couple of years time we’ll long for “The Good Old Days of Heyneke”
Oops!!!
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/rugby/argentina-halfback-tomas-cubelli-suffers-embarrassing-setback-before-finally-joining-the-brumbies/story-fni2fxyf-1227635724519
I do not think transformation in SA rugby, if properly implemented, and performance are mutually exclusive. In theory “proper transformation” should increase the number of “viable” players who can be considered for national selection and that can only lead to stronger teams… if they can pick a team from say 2 million people it should certainly be stronger than a team picked from a million people.
robzim wrote:
In theory maybe, but in practise it’s not going to improve the standard of rugby
As for the 1 million vs 2 million argument, I do recall the 1 million team had a better win lose ration against the All Blacks and everyone else before readmission
No losses against Wales, Argentina or Japan
69: ja ek moet bieg, ek het slegter gevoel oor die Bulle se verloor teen Wiepie op Loftus in die CB semi, as die Bokke se verloor teen NZ in die WB semi ….. ten minste het die Bokke teen ‘n kampioenspan verloor !
In rugby is wat gebeur oppie veld die heel belangrikste, maar daar is dinge wat saam met dit gaan wat ook belangrik is, soos geskiedenis, tradisie, bokembleem, trots, truie, gees/guts (hierbo genoem).
Dit lyk my die ANC-SARU is nou gatvol dat hul Bafana Banana sokkerspan al naby nr.100 in die wêreld is, en ons ‘wit’ rugby en krieketspanne tel nog onder die bestes in die wêreld.
Daar is meer regstellende aksie nou nodig om die balans te verbeter in ons sportspanne ….. almal moet nou swakker word ?
Ons is almal nie gelukkig met HM se vou soos ‘n vadoek hierdie jaar nie (ek dink hy het nie te sleg gedoen die vorige 3 jaar nie, behalwe dat hy meer die AB kon gewen het, en ten minste een 4nasie trofee kon gewen het), maar ek dink ons moet verwonderd wees dat ons na 1995, vir nog 20 jaar met al die politieke druk, onder verskillende afrigters, onder die eerste 5 top spanne in die wêreld getel het, en meestal in die 2de posisie. Dan ook nog die 2007 WB oorwinning.
As AC dit gaan regkry om ons daar te hou, of nog te laat opskuif, sal dit ‘n wonderwerk wees, en ek sal eerste daar wees om hom geluk te wens.
Maar ek twyfel, dit is dalk net ‘n kwessie van tyd dat SARU gaan besluit dat net spelers wat in SA speel gekies gaan word … en die boktrui en embleem moet verdwyn.
Die ANC-SARU allianse moet besef dit is nie net hulle jeugliga wat gatvol raak nie, daar is ander mense van ons land wat ook nou begin gatvol raak vir al hierdie politiek in die sport. Dit is nie net swak rugby nie, maar ook al meer politiek wat die stadions nog meer leeg gaan maak as dit so aanhou.
Hoe meer die unies buig onder politieke druk, hoe meer gaan hul hul tradisionele ondersteuningsbasis begin verloor.
En ons kan reeds sien hoe swak ons superrugby spanne geword het, met soveel van ons beste spelers wat nou in Europa speel. Ja vir geld, maar ook vir die toestand van ons landjie, eish.
Mense is swartgallig oor die toekoms van ons rugby, soos ons land, en mens kan hul dit nie eintlik kwalik neem nie.
Ben-die-Bul wrote:
Die feit dat jong outjies soos Willemse eerder oorsee gaan speel as om te bly om ‘n Bok te word wys vir jou daar’s fout
Amerika begin ‘n professionele liga volgende jaar, jy gaan sien hoeveel ouens daar gaan speel
Ben-die-Bul wrote:
<blockquotemaar ek dink ons moet verwonderd wees dat ons na 1995, vir nog 20 jaar met al die politieke druk, onder verskillende afrigters, onder die eerste 5 top spanne in die wêreld getel het, en meestal in die 2de posisie. Dan ook nog die 2007 WB oorwinning.
Ons het bo verwagting goed presteer
Maar die krake wys, spanne soos Argentinië, Wallis en Ierland (en Japan) daag deesdae op met die idee dat hulle kan wen.
In die verlede het hulle probeer om die telling laag the hou, hier en daar ‘n mooi drie te druk, maar hulle het geweet hulle het nie ‘n kans nie
Nou vat hulle ons aan want hulle weet ons is kwesbaar
nortie wrote:
We have to play the overseas players but we need to implement the same system where an overseas player only becomes eligible once he’s played 50 tests, or 60 tests like the Wallabies do
They are very smart, that way you can retain star players yet still give youngster a chance
@ Victoriabok:
Na die leeus toer in 2019 gaan n klomp belowende spelers in new zealand charles piutau, luke mccalister ens se voetspore volg.
Dit gebeur net vinniger hier omdat ons land so agteruit boer, maar teensy daar groot reforms kom europa gaan dit gebeur gaan die suidelike halfrond se spelers uitvloei.
MacroPolo wrote:
DIe verskil is die NZ en Australiese geldeenhede nie so verswak het nie en hulle spelers nogsteeds ‘n goeie salaris in hulle eie land kan verdien
robzim wrote:
When is anything implemented properly in this country?
Guys, we can moan and groan about transformation all we want, but unless something changes at government level, its going away. It has also been mentioned that if done properly, performance will not be affected. I love visiting one of the Easter rugby festivals that proliferate Joburg at that time of the year. I see some great talent, both black and white. What happens to these youngsters after school? Even the provincial (Craven Week) and national age groups are representative. Yet, many black kids seem to fall by the wayside. Is it that they do not want to pursue rugby as a career, or is it because the scouts seem to have blinkers on?
BDB made this comment: “So was Kolisi nie beter as Coetzee of Kriel nie, en Paige nie beter as Hougaard nie.” My opinion is that both Kolisi and Coetzee are great players, but I feel Kolisi plays a smarter game, so I would rather play Kolisi before Coetzee ( Coetzee plays a similar game to Burger. Extremely busy, but at times very ineffective). And both Hougaard and Paige are nowhere as good as Faf de Klerk.
So the unions need to give their scouts an instruction to sign 60% black and 40% white school boys for the next two or so years, so that there are sufficient POC’s with enough talent to be considered for SR or CC. Problem solved in a year or two.
Victoriabok wrote:
You cannot blame the fact that the Boks’ winning percentage against the AB’s have dropped since readmission on only transformation in SA rugby. The AB’s have become much better and one of the reasons is the influx of Polynesian islanders to the AB teams while they have also adjusted much better to professionalism than SA. The profile of a modern day NZ team is a lot different then during the 60’s or 70’s so it’s like comparing apples to pears. The AB’s all time winning rate against all other teams have also picked up since professionalism ( I think their all time winning rate against ALL opposition is about 78% but since 2011 it is up to about 93%).
@ Victoriabok:
“I think 65% should be seen as the new benchmark…”
65%, or thereabouts, has always been the benchmark. Not even when they “dominated” world rugby for nearly 100 years, could they boast an overall winning percentage of 70% or more
I put up some stats to support this fact.
So, it WON”T be because of transformation if the Boks win “only” 65% of their matches in the future.
73 @ Victoriabok:
“As for the 1 million vs 2 million argument, I do recall the 1 million team had a better win lose ration against the All Blacks and everyone else before readmission
No losses against Wales, Argentina or Japan”
How many games did they play against the AB at home vs in NZ? Maybe that was the reason for their positive win/lose ratio. Hometown refs and all and all.
Afa losing against Arg and Japan. The 1 million never played against them in an official test. May I remind you that the 1 million actually LOST against the Jaquars, a raap en skraap team from S. America, loaded with Arg players, with only one world class player (Hugo Porta) in their midst. In the loss against Wales, who was the coach and how many “transformation” players were in that team?
Please man, stop trying to blame “transformation” for the woes of SA Rugby in general and Bok rugby in particular. Whenever we do that, we are not looking, and trying to rectify, the real problem(s). Look at Scrumdown’s post (#53) for an objective look at possible problems that have a much bigger impact on the Bok’s performance than “transformation”.
Been out of circulation for 5 days or so… nasty time of the year!
Flippen big things coming off at the same time… hectic, hectic, hectic!
Things SHOULD return to relative normal tomorrow, freegin hell!
Nama wrote:
The coach was your beloved Nick-I’m-a-god-in-the Cape Mallet
The first time in 100 years we lost against them
Nama wrote:
I never said transformation the reason we lost, playing too old (Vic) and the wrong players (Ruan etc.) was and following the wrong strategy (FdP kicking all possession away)
I do have a problem with next years transformation agenda being implemented by the government and SARU
You don’t need to protect the black players, they are a rare much sought after commodity
Just look how fast the big unions grabbed the unpaid Kings players?
New Zealand had all sorts of issues in the 1990’s, until they sorted it out both in administration and coaching in the early 2000’s.
For SA,the best are coached and administered out of the system. It’s systemic:
1.Trying to run a modern attack off a 9 is like using your smartphone with old Motorola DynaTAC 8000X. chipsets.
2.Even the most progressive thinking of SA pundits,cannot accept that the general of the game MUST be the flyhalf.
Meyer beat OZ 4-3 (Deans+McKenzie,Lost to Cheika).
The point being that Deans beat P-Div a lot and Meyer righted that ship .
However he NEVER found a way to trouble AB’s.
P-Div could trouble the AB’s,but then not Dingo Deans’ Wallabies.
Meyer’s flaw is that he didn’tt take much note of the 2009 law interpretation changes in which no team playing bash and boot rugby will be the best in the world.It had nothing to do with any issues i.e. provinces or politics for that matter. He had access to one of the top five playing pools in world rugby and didn’tt make proper use of it.
Added to that,Meyer’s national passion on display has to be one of the most OTT I’ve yet to see any other Bok coach does:How many teams that cry through their national anthems ever win tests?Argie maybe the only exception in Durban 2015 I can think off…But do the All Blacks ever crank up or break down when speaking about New Zealand?
Anyway,there are structural problems within South African Rugby, not least of which is how only a few franchises can have the lion’s share of all the talent that’s available many of which gets wasted anyway in their larger squads,unlike in New Zealand who partial draft spreads the talent that allows franchises to keep their very strongest local products.
There were also serious intra squad disputes that Meyer had to resolve and I’m pretty sure Matfield & Bismarck would’ve been very difficult to rein in.
South Africa now needs a coach with an interest in contemporary expansive rugby,not another crash and bash merchant.Meyer was defensive oriented,but Allister Coetzee will be even more so if gets the job.
87 @ provincefan:
Welcome to Rugby-Talk.com!
I saw your registration for the site go through, as webmaster of the site, so know it is your first comment here!
…. and what a comment it is, your reasoning is sound and you are most welcome… good to have you aboard!
@ provincefan:
Welcome – sound assessment/arguments.
http://www.supersport.com/rugby/blogs/gavin-rich/My_Bok_coaching_dream_team
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